The future of Porteus

New features which should be implemented in Porteus; suggestions are welcome. All questions or problems with testing releases (alpha, beta, or rc) should go in their relevant thread here, rather than the Bug Reports section.
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Re: The future of Porteus

Post#226 by Blaze » 07 Jan 2016, 13:11

IMHO, Arch base on Manjaro Linux without systemd is better way than Ubuntu LST. My vote for Arch.
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Re: The future of Porteus

Post#227 by fullmoonremix » 07 Jan 2016, 16:35

Salutations... :good:

IMHO... :oops: Porteus already has the .tgz... .txz... user base so with .deb and .rpm added it would become the default "live" OS for ALL systemd refugees.
It's better they switch to Porteus than BSD. (It also seems to appear the "Slackonly" repo resolved a good deal of the package availability concerns).

Best Regards... :beer:

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Re: The future of Porteus

Post#228 by TT4Foss » 08 Jan 2016, 03:01

@Brokenman

I've never used Arch so I probably wouldn't be much help with building a new system right now.

However after the next stable release is out, perhaps I could share some ideas for an updated slackware release, delivered by new volunteers (very ambitious goal).

In the mean time ...

A good learning task for new volunteers might to see if Slack.Porteus v3.1 could be recreated. Are there any script files used for that release (say perhaps in GitHub or some other fine repo)?

If enough people could pick up the skills to recreate Slack.Porteus v3.1 then an updated release should be much easier. There might be enough interest in Slack.Porteus for volunteers to start learning. It might be a painful process but the skills learned might prove to be invaluable down the road.

I was just thinking that interested people could start learning about building slack while the Arch release is being prepared (and perhaps don't ask you slack related questions until after Arch released).
There probably isn't much documentation about building Porteus so people will have to learn and document at the same time but if there were enough volunteers who could find their way around a system, they could all help each other.

Not sure if there would be enough interest in such a group effort. If there is enough interest then perhaps start a new topic.

I've never built a system before so I'm guessing as to what skills would be required.
Some knowledge of bash would be required as would knowledge of how to build/install programs from source (including being able to read configure & make files) and a good overview of the boot process specific to the Linux base distribution (they are all a bit different).
These are skills that a good Jedi-wanna-be-and-whatever-else Linux guru should know.

Myself, I'm leaning towards a Debian-Porteus idea, but I'm getting too far ahead of myself.

Thanks again

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Re: The future of Porteus

Post#229 by brokenman » 08 Jan 2016, 03:56

I will see what I can do about giving you some scripts and a package list to work from. I built slackware-current porteus last week and it is running fine. Just need to tie up some loose ends. I can give you the 000,001,002 modules that you can unpack to a partition, then chroot into the partition to start building. It would be great to see people start building and learning. I could use the help.
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Re: The future of Porteus

Post#230 by francois » 08 Jan 2016, 04:49

I agree with brokenman, the main problem with porteus has been the availability of software. This has an impact on the forum help effort which has to be spent on new members. No distribution could beat Ubuntu-debian in terms of availability of software. Ubuntu is said to be more desktop oriented.

An Ubuntu base might draw a greater number of newcomers, just because they would like to try another flavor of Ubuntu, as an example EOS has attracted a good crowd of new members. From the crowd some number of contributors critically missing could be attracted.

Debian dog partly based on porteus has bren made according to the puppy's way. Porteus has its own personnality: a modular, cleaner, simpler structure. Resolve the larger package pasture issue of porteus with Ubuntu you get the perfect hybrid in terms of small weight distribution.

However, it seems to me that porteus-archlinux-manjaro is not that far. Though with use, AUR package coverage and managenent, added to the rolling release feature might still present potential package management issues. Do we want to get rid completely off the package management issues? Could there be package management issues related to an Ubuntu base? What are the advantages of arch linux as a base compared to ubuntu?
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Re: The future of Porteus

Post#231 by sean » 09 Jan 2016, 12:03

@brokenman,

Have you considered announcing Nemesis to DistroWatch?

Sean

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Re: The future of Porteus

Post#232 by brokenman » 10 Jan 2016, 22:21

sean wrote:@brokenman,

Have you considered announcing Nemesis to DistroWatch?

Sean
No. I'd prefer to keep the testing ground just here for now. We will announce to distrowatch when the next official version is released.
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Re: The future of Porteus

Post#233 by francois » 11 Jan 2016, 12:57

There might be fun with a base distro that offers some challenges like arch or manjaro, and according to stifiling arch is more tight in terms of response than the debian variants. However, I would appreciate that he would provide personally on the question. The manjaro fans might appreciate a porteus version.

The point of view of ncmprhnsbl who has a good knowledge of arch linux and archbang could be interesting too.
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Re: The future of Porteus

Post#234 by wread » 12 Jan 2016, 21:14

@brokenman
I read you are working on 000, 001 and 002 of Porteus Slackware-current. As a matter of fact I am using 003-kde5 right now (64 bits), with 001 and 002 current. 000 is still 3.17 I think, my Toshiba Satellite does ok with it.
Some pieces of software are still reluctant (i.e. GE 7.1.4) to the new environment. My kde5 is still not bundled, and if you are interested, I could send you a tarball of it, so you can trim it 'a la fanthom' and release it.

KDE and Slackware current have introduced many changes and I had spent hours searching for the right place of archives that now are in different place.

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Re: The future of Porteus

Post#235 by brokenman » 12 Jan 2016, 23:58

Thanks Wread. If you could you send me a list of /var/log/packages for 003-kde5 it would be much appreciated.
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Re: The future of Porteus

Post#236 by datruche » 13 Jan 2016, 22:44

Quite vital posts in this thread, of which interesting ones! A result is that I only read the first 4 pages :angel: So I'll keep discussing the main subject for later. Better leave some feedback after installing Nemesis (posting from it).

Instructions to initialize the package manager.
Though they may be somewhere I didn't see them yet. Thought it might help those who want to test Nemesis.

1. Upgrade pacman db
2. Choose your best mirrors (simply uncomment 3-10 of the official repos that are closest to your computer)
3. Update the db
4. Initialize Pacman's packages signature (mandatory)
5. Make Nemesis your way

Code: Select all

$  sudo pacman-db-upgrade
$  sudo vi /etc/pacman.d/mirrorlist
$  sudo pacman -Sy
$  sudo pacman-key --init  # can take 1-2 minutes on a low-profile machine
$  sudo pacman-key --populate
Optional 
$  sudo pacman -S <some_good_browser>
$  sudo pacman -S bash-completion-2.1-5
A raw feedback on Nemesis Defaults

Default conf
* Term: Guest default to a bold font which I find huge on a 1376*768 laptop. tty is bold and very Arch-default. I much rather the thinner font that comes in a new user's virtual terminal.
* Guest user has gid 1000, which does not exist.

Base packages
(dunno if modules are en route yet)
* Add bash-completion (it's allready implemented in /etc/bash/bashrc and will be on upon first boot, rather than install + source or reboot)
* keep Porteus 3.1's mousepad while it's 830 KiB vs 250 for leafpad, it has tabs, "Recent files", indent... invaluable IMHO
* What about wireless connection as there's not even a way to connect wireless yet. Maybe netctl with wpa_supplicant? it has `wifi-menu` (ncurses) and weight 720 KiB total.

Now I understand why brokenman rather call it Nemesis. It's not yet Porteus Nemesis.

PS: atm I'm testing the effectiveness of a few distros to achieve some very casual tasks. Through real-world scenarios (that I'm putting together rather painfully, may post on that as interaction would most certainly help). Would that interest some of you if I use them to test how Nemesis compares to Porteus (and Arch is well engaged), when it starts to become Porteus Nemesis?

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Re: The future of Porteus

Post#237 by brokenman » 13 Jan 2016, 23:37

You can setup the package manager by running: setup-pman
After this you an use pman in the same way as pacman. The difference is it will make a Portues module at the end.
What about wireless connection as there's not even a way to connect wireless yet.
You can put the details in the 'config' folder which is in the root of the install media. You can also run setup-network. If you boot into a GUI then networkmanager should be in the tray and you can just use that to connect.

Your other points I will implement. Thanks.
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Re: The future of Porteus

Post#238 by datruche » 14 Jan 2016, 00:16

Ok!
I'll check setup-pman on next boot. Someone knows which page it's on
I'd like to know what it does exactly, e.g. does it take care of the whole sequence (pacman-keyring.., mirrors' choice)? ANd if choosing the mirrors for us, what's the backend (near/speedy *and* up-to-date mirrors are a key point when running Arch)

Some more feedback :

* Networkmanager was not part of the Tray icons. Saw Menu, minimise, ... keyboard layout and logout.
* What about displaying the distro's short 'Notes to start' (bare minimum to start) on gui/tty login?
* A text browser like elinks soulhd be included in base Nemesis
* Cheatcodes:
- kmap: flag's in the Tray; keymap still in qwerty (gui & tty). `loadkeys` and `setxkmap` run fine so not a big deal atm for testers.
- Starting with Graphics I have yet to get Nemesis save changes between upon reboot. Used the 'changes=EXIT:/path/to/change-folder' cheatcode. Do you guys know where to look for up-to-date cheatcodes?

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Re: The future of Porteus

Post#239 by brokenman » 14 Jan 2016, 03:29

I'd like to know what it does exactly
It takes care of updating database, it asks you which mirror you prefer, it updates ca-trust and initiates pacman keyrings then updates pacman database.

* Networkmanager was not part of the Tray icons. Saw Menu, minimise, ... keyboard layout and logout.
Did you boot into graphical mode or start from runlevel 3 using startx?

* What about displaying the distro's short 'Notes to start' (bare minimum to start) on gui/tty login?
We will eventually have a first run wizard.

* A text browser like elinks soulhd be included in base Nemesis
lynx. This is required for some of the scripts so it ships as default.

* Cheatcodes:
Do you guys know where to look for up-to-date cheatcodes?
I haven't really gone through and tested all the cheatcodes as yet. changes= does work.
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Re: The future of Porteus

Post#240 by brokenman » 21 Jan 2016, 00:03

Thanks Wread. If you could you send me a list of /var/log/packages for 003-kde5 it would be much appreciated.
Any progress on this yet Wread?

EDIT:
Ok I went ahead. After a day of head scratching, I have kde5 booting here but I could really use your expertise with it here Wread. Tips on any pitfalls you may have encountered (especially graphics related) would be appreciated.
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