Official Package Manager

New features which should be implemented in Porteus; suggestions are welcome. All questions or problems with testing releases (alpha, beta, or rc) should go in their relevant thread here, rather than the Bug Reports section.
Locked
User avatar
brokenman
Site Admin
Site Admin
Posts: 5652
Joined: 27 Dec 2010, 03:50
Distribution: Porteus v3.2rcX all desktops
Location: Brazil
Contact:

Re: Official Package Manager

Post#46 by brokenman » 15 Jul 2011, 20:07

At the moment i am creating a front end for sbopkg .... but this is quite a task and i don't think we need ALL of the features available in it. I will look at src2pkg and see what can be done with it. Thanks for the lead. It looks like fanthoms idea of including 2 other distro's packages may be attainable also!
How do i become super user?
Wear your underpants on the outside and put on a cape.

User avatar
francois
Contributor
Contributor
Posts: 5124
Joined: 28 Dec 2010, 14:25
Distribution: xfce plank porteus artix
Location: C'est l'hiver: la neige soudainement est là à Montréal.

Re: Official Package Manager

Post#47 by francois » 15 Jul 2011, 22:22

This is a good idea. What distros are we talking about?
Carpe diem.

User avatar
brokenman
Site Admin
Site Admin
Posts: 5652
Joined: 27 Dec 2010, 03:50
Distribution: Porteus v3.2rcX all desktops
Location: Brazil
Contact:

Re: Official Package Manager

Post#48 by brokenman » 15 Jul 2011, 23:12

debian and fedora look doable and Porteus contains the conversion tools for these.. I have yet to test if the packages work but they have a structure that allows us to hook in and download/convert packages.

I had a look at src2pkg ... my first impression is that there are a few flaws. The package is over 3Mb but i managed to trim it down to around 100Kb and it still runs. My first two test src packages failed. I expected this because my last attempt at an automated build script followed the same path. Every source is different and required various extra switches during compilation. The whole idea of the PPM is to make package management a breeze for beginners. More advanced users have the experience to install src2pkg and tweak to their needs.

Secondly it opens up the 'pandoras box' of downloading unknown source and building a package from it. There is no 'universal source code database' that almost guarantees safe source. I really like the program (src2pkg) and will use it myself to compile locally and create slackware packages to use on our repo ... but at the moment i think it strays from the whole concept of the PPM.
How do i become super user?
Wear your underpants on the outside and put on a cape.

Falcony
Full of knowledge
Full of knowledge
Posts: 235
Joined: 01 Jan 2011, 12:44
Location: Russia

Re: Official Package Manager

Post#49 by Falcony » 18 Jul 2011, 12:06

brokenman wrote:debian and fedora look doable and Porteus contains the conversion tools for these.. I have yet to test if the packages work but they have a structure that allows us to hook in and download/convert packages.

I had a look at src2pkg ... my first impression is that there are a few flaws. The package is over 3Mb but i managed to trim it down to around 100Kb and it still runs. My first two test src packages failed. I expected this because my last attempt at an automated build script followed the same path. Every source is different and required various extra switches during compilation. The whole idea of the PPM is to make package management a breeze for beginners. More advanced users have the experience to install src2pkg and tweak to their needs.

Secondly it opens up the 'pandoras box' of downloading unknown source and building a package from it. There is no 'universal source code database' that almost guarantees safe source. I really like the program (src2pkg) and will use it myself to compile locally and create slackware packages to use on our repo ... but at the moment i think it strays from the whole concept of the PPM.
I do not like src2pkg. It is no contain not fetch depends list. It good tool but for manual package creation from sources. Previosly I spent some and may say it is not convinient.

PS. Have you tried slax-build tool from fidoslax module?

It worls very simple - get depnds list from SlackBuild.org site, then get SlackBuild, then get sources, build package and convert it to xzm module.

You could easy adopt slax-build for PPM as it create Slackware package and get full deps list.

This will allow Porteus users to create easy own modules from sources - if there are no ones in Porteus repo.

Also there is crux-buld tool - it also create xzm module Slackware package but gets rule of building and deps list from CRUX Linux repository

User avatar
brokenman
Site Admin
Site Admin
Posts: 5652
Joined: 27 Dec 2010, 03:50
Distribution: Porteus v3.2rcX all desktops
Location: Brazil
Contact:

Re: Official Package Manager

Post#50 by brokenman » 18 Jul 2011, 16:47

Hi Falcony!,

I am currently incorporating a Slackbuilds function into the PPM. It will be very similar to the sbopkg tool. I already have the Fidoslax option finished too! I hadn't looked at CRUX but i will have a look and see if i have enough time to incorporate it.
How do i become super user?
Wear your underpants on the outside and put on a cape.

Falcony
Full of knowledge
Full of knowledge
Posts: 235
Joined: 01 Jan 2011, 12:44
Location: Russia

Re: Official Package Manager

Post#51 by Falcony » 03 Aug 2011, 11:33

@brokenman ,

I started filling FIDOSlax repo on googlecode with new and fresh modules builded on Porteus 1.0

New extention for new moduless now is *--0.1.5--.xzm so for such modules conversions is not required

Could I have 1.1 vestion of PPM?

I am interting in.

pizzar0
White ninja
White ninja
Posts: 28
Joined: 08 May 2011, 22:26
Location: Chritmas Island

Re: Official Package Manager

Post#52 by pizzar0 » 03 Aug 2011, 14:57

@falcony
Secondly it opens up the 'pandoras box' of downloading unknown source and building a package from it. There is no 'universal source code database' that almost guarantees safe source. I really like the program (src2pkg) and will use it myself to compile locally and create slackware packages to use on our repo ... but at the moment i think it strays from the whole concept of the PPM.
Actually there is a "universal source code database" and its called: Slackware.
So before going on a tangent trying to reinvent the wheel why not, for example, run a dependency check on Slackware Current (on the whole thing) and convince yourself what needs what, how and why?! (you'll be very surprised.) Just a thought...
Also, what you might find if you follow the above suggestion, you will also probably understand the "unreasonable surge" of single application (one per task) distros which is about the only sane thing to do on a portable distro - and for any distro, for that matter.

Who exactly feels that beginners must have easy installation/access to 10-15 different text editors otherwise the world would come to an end?? -Because if thats the case then they are not beginners anymore (they know what/why they want) and so they are just as capable compiling their own apps.

@fanthom

The only reason why I'm pointing out the more obvious flaws in in the process/design and thinking here (not so much with Porteus itself, yet) is because there is a Live Distro out there in the making (currently in alpha) based on one of the oldest and by far the most respected distribution forks in linux history - not to mention its designed by the original developers. If/when that hits, you guys might be deeply disappointed with all the work and resulting (lack) of relevancy of Porteus itself. I, myself would not like to see that. Just a friendly observation...

User avatar
francois
Contributor
Contributor
Posts: 5124
Joined: 28 Dec 2010, 14:25
Distribution: xfce plank porteus artix
Location: C'est l'hiver: la neige soudainement est là à Montréal.

Re: Official Package Manager

Post#53 by francois » 03 Aug 2011, 15:05

The only reason why I'm pointing out the more obvious flaws in in the process/design and thinking here (not so much with Porteus itself, yet) is because there is a Live Distro out there in the making (currently in alpha) based on one of the oldest and by far the most respected distribution forks in linux history - not to mention its designed by the original developers.
Can you give the name of the distro or the link?
Carpe diem.

pizzar0
White ninja
White ninja
Posts: 28
Joined: 08 May 2011, 22:26
Location: Chritmas Island

Re: Official Package Manager

Post#54 by pizzar0 » 03 Aug 2011, 16:36

Can you give the name of the distro or the link?
I could except the developers seem somewhat protective of it at this stage. (alpha 0.1)
I did ask them, though, if I could say anything about it and they said "rather not, yet". (I probably shouldn't have said anything in the first place. My bad.) Its obviously Slack based...

User avatar
francois
Contributor
Contributor
Posts: 5124
Joined: 28 Dec 2010, 14:25
Distribution: xfce plank porteus artix
Location: C'est l'hiver: la neige soudainement est là à Montréal.

Re: Official Package Manager

Post#55 by francois » 03 Aug 2011, 16:51

Thanks. I am always interested in new development. 8)
Carpe diem.

User avatar
fanthom
Site Admin
Site Admin
Posts: 4625
Joined: 28 Dec 2010, 02:42
Distribution: Porteus Kiosk
Location: Poland, currently - Cork, IE
Contact:

Re: Official Package Manager

Post#56 by fanthom » 04 Aug 2011, 06:41

@pizzar0
do you mean that we should stop working on Porteus because someone, somewhere is making a better linux distro?
my apologize if i missed your point.

and sorry for off top :)
Please add [Solved] to your thread title if the solution was found.

Falcony
Full of knowledge
Full of knowledge
Posts: 235
Joined: 01 Jan 2011, 12:44
Location: Russia

Re: Official Package Manager

Post#57 by Falcony » 04 Aug 2011, 09:39

@pizzar0,
Actually there is a "universal source code database" and its called: Slackware.
So before going on a tangent trying to reinvent the wheel why not, for example, run a dependency check on Slackware Current (on the whole thing) and convince yourself what needs what, how and why?! (you'll be very surprised.) Just a thought...
I meant software beyond of Slackware.
Also, what you might find if you follow the above suggestion, you will also probably understand the "unreasonable surge" of single application (one per task) distros which is about the only sane thing to do on a portable distro - and for any distro, for that matter.
Slackware not cover any task.

One per tasks not good on linux as sometime one way is not goog enoght, other also, etc...

Not mentions that's users likes familiars things that they knows L)

More over I personally whould like to have not only portable distro but possability to use it as main distro.

paldepind
Ronin
Ronin
Posts: 3
Joined: 03 Aug 2011, 12:19
Location: Denmark

Re: Official Package Manager

Post#58 by paldepind » 04 Aug 2011, 14:11

brokenman: I don't know if you're already aware of it. But for updating modules zsync could be very handy for limiting download size.

User avatar
brokenman
Site Admin
Site Admin
Posts: 5652
Joined: 27 Dec 2010, 03:50
Distribution: Porteus v3.2rcX all desktops
Location: Brazil
Contact:

Re: Official Package Manager

Post#59 by brokenman » 05 Oct 2011, 23:10

I've been away for a while.

So before going on a tangent trying to reinvent the wheel why not, for example, run a dependency check on Slackware Current
Um ... That's exactly what PPM does.

Who exactly feels that beginners must have easy installation/access
I certainly do. I believe one of the main reasons linux isn't more popular now is precisely because beginners lack/ed easy installation and access to apps.

otherwise the world would come to an end??
Nothing as drastic as that. They would just drop the distro like a brick and find something more manageable.

Because if thats the case then they are not beginners anymore (they know what/why they want) and so they are just as capable compiling their own apps.
Tell that to a nob fresh from windows. Why are they not beginners anymore when they know what they want? A beginner may want an image editor that handles vectors. Ok, so now they know what they want ... have they suddenly graduated to somewhere above beginner. No, they must now take on the task of finding the app and ALL of it's deps. This is what PPM addresses.

If/when that hits, you guys might be deeply disappointed with all the work and resulting (lack) of relevancy of Porteus itself.
Brokenman spits on the ground, and grinds his heel into the wet earth. His finger twitches on his holster.
Why? Did Ford stop building cars when Ferarri hit the scene? Did windows pack up when the open source linux hit? Did they stop making vanilla ice cream when chocolate arrived? I fail to see your logic in that statement. Diverse tastes and preferences is precisely why linux has branched at such a steady rate. What will make Porteus less relevant when this 'all mighty' portable distro arrives?
How do i become super user?
Wear your underpants on the outside and put on a cape.

User avatar
francois
Contributor
Contributor
Posts: 5124
Joined: 28 Dec 2010, 14:25
Distribution: xfce plank porteus artix
Location: C'est l'hiver: la neige soudainement est là à Montréal.

Re: Official Package Manager

Post#60 by francois » 06 Oct 2011, 01:52

If/when that hits, you guys might be deeply disappointed with all the work and resulting (lack) of relevancy of Porteus itself.
If it is slackware live, at present there no much to fear:
http://slackware-live.tuxfamily.org/-Home-

Please search with google (keywords:porteus francois.e slackware live) as all porteus links actually refer to:
faq.php
To pursue the discussion on the appropriate thread.
Carpe diem.

Locked