Installing Porteus alongside Windows 8.1 (dualbooting)

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Szalay
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Installing Porteus alongside Windows 8.1 (dualbooting)

Post#1 by Szalay » 18 Jul 2015, 21:53

Hello!


First of all I would like to clarify that I`m new to Linux, the only Linux i actually used is the Tails OS, for browsing the net when i`m not at home.

I always used Windows since it was easier to play games, which used to be my first priority. Since time passed by and i got a little older (and started that ugly thing, most people call adult life), I don't have that much time for gaming and i need a fast, reliable OS. I started looking for a Linux distro. After checking out the Ubuntu, the Ubuntu mate and the Elementary OS i finally arrived at Porteus, and after trying out from a Live USB i decided that this is what i want.


Now my problem is that i wish to run this alongside my windows 8.1 (which i need for gaming and for the microsoft office software pack).

I got a pretty old laptop with a hard disk using MBR, so i can only have 4 primary partitions. Currently i have 3 primary partition (one system partition with only 100mb, created when i installed the windows, and two other, one for the windows and softwares, and other for my documents and games)

So first of all, i would like to know if its possible to run the two OS on the same laptop (dualboot), and secondly, i would like to ask for a step-by-step manual for installing this without messing up my windows.


Any help is appreciated. :good:
Last edited by Szalay on 19 Jul 2015, 01:14, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Installing Porteus beside Windows 8.1

Post#2 by Ed_P » 19 Jul 2015, 00:08

Well, on the old laptop you could make it duel boot by adding a grub4dos grldr file to it and creating a menu.lst then boot Porteus as an ISO. If the old system is Windows XP it's a matter of tweaking the boot.ini file. If it's a Windows 7 system you tweak the BCD file. Those are the only Windows changes needed. See this posting for more info on this approach: viewtopic.php?f=48&t=4471&p=34565#p34337

BTW Your topic title is misleading if you're talking about the laptop. For running Porteus beside Windows 8.1 that can be done also but would be from a USB drive. For that approach see this posting: https://forum.porteus.org/viewtopic.php ... 638#p33604
Ed

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Re: Installing Porteus alongside Windows 8.1 (dualbooting)

Post#3 by francois » 19 Jul 2015, 12:08

1.0 usb installation. Porteus will run on USB as fast as on your hdd. Why don't you just begin this way to get accustomed with it and with Linux? This way you will not break your windows installation for sure.

2.0 Dual not with porteus.To run porteus on hdd you would be better to create an additional Linux partition like ext2,3 or 4. As porteus is Linux, it runs better on Linux filesystem. If you intend to use porteus regularly a 10 to 20 gig would put you at ease. For porteus to run, only one partition is needed.

2.1 install porteus on a CD or on USB from windows see FAQ. Use the xfce environment as it includes gparted.
2.2 use gparted to resize the data partition and to create your porteus partition (backup your important data). Personally I would create an extended partition as big as I could for my Linux installations.
2.3 install a bootloader that will permit dual boot. Ed has proposed grub4dos, I propose grub legacy. See installing porteus on hdd:
viewtopic.php?f=48&t=4471
viewtopic.php?f=62&t=946

For an abstract of useful information and command for porteus, see:
viewtopic.php?f=81&t=3318
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Re: Installing Porteus alongside Windows 8.1 (dualbooting)

Post#4 by Ed_P » 19 Jul 2015, 23:45

francois wrote:2.3 install a bootloader that will permit dual boot. Ed has proposed grub4dos, I propose grub legacy.
Actually I do not propose installing a dual boot loader, rather using an easy to customize one with the Windows built in boot loader. Adding the grldr file to the C: drive is not an install of grub4dos. Installing it replaces the Windows boot loader and I don't use or recommend that approach. I support keeping Windows as native as possible and XP's, Vista's and Windows 7 boot loaders support booting multiple systems but using grub4dos's menu capabilities makes it a lot easier to add other systems like Porteus so I combine the best of both worlds. grub4dos menus are very similar to Legacy grub's but grub4dos is maintained and enhanced whereas Legacy grub is dead.
Ed

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Re: Installing Porteus alongside Windows 8.1 (dualbooting)

Post#5 by sunnysideofthesun » 20 Jul 2015, 01:16

To write "step-by-step manual for installing this without messing up your windows" I'd need to do everything on your computer with your windows. But the general way of adding Linux to Windows preserving Windows monarchy is to boot Linux with Windows loader. I guess it is buried somewhere deep in Ed_P's links to threads too.

First you have to install Porteus to free partition (and do not overwrite windows bootloader accidentally). Since it can be 32 or 64 bit for bios or uefi systems, I don't know if all variants will work for dualbooting this way. Methods of installing are described on forum and in FAQ. I only can tell that you won't have access to ext2/3/4 and other non-FAT and non-NTFS filesystems from Windows without third-party drivers and utilities. And if you will use FAT then it won't differ much from usb flash stick.

After installing you will have to make a copy of bootsector from linux partition and add boot entry for Windows loader.
One of many descriptions of how to do this you may find here http://alien.slackbook.org/blog/adding- ... boot-menu/
You'll need dd for Windows as well http://www.chrysocome.net/dd because you won't be able to boot in Linux. To see how Windows calls drives and partitions (unlike Linux /dev/sda for example) run dd --list.
Or after installing Porteus you can try EasyBCD, then this utilty will add boot entry for you (hopefully) https://neosmart.net/EasyBCD/ . It's free for personal use.
If you survive task of making dualboot system, then you'll be able to wreck Windows from Porteus. Good luck.

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Re: Installing Porteus alongside Windows 8.1 (dualbooting)

Post#6 by Ed_P » 21 Jul 2015, 04:05

sunnysideofthesun wrote:To write "step-by-step manual for installing this without messing up your windows" I'd need to do everything on your computer with your windows.
On Windows systems using the boot.ini file not necessarily, on Windows systems using the BCD file probably. See this posting for more details. viewtopic.php?f=81&t=4845&start=15#p35355
But the general way of adding Linux to Windows preserving Windows monarchy is to boot Linux with Windows loader. I guess it is buried somewhere deep in Ed_P's links to threads too.
Not that deep, see the above link. :)
First you have to install Porteus to free partition (and do not overwrite windows bootloader accidentally).
Actually you don't have to install Porteus, nor need a free partition, thus minimal impact on the existing system. See the above link.
Since it can be 32 or 64 bit for bios or uefi systems, I don't know if all variants will work for dualbooting this way.
While I have access to a UEFI machine I can't say if the steps in my above link will work on a UEFI system. For booting Porteus on the UEFI system, and non-UEFI systems I use the approach in this link: https://forum.porteus.org/viewtopic.php ... 638#p33604
After installing you will have to make a copy of bootsector from linux partition and add boot entry for Windows loader.
One of many descriptions of how to do this you may find here http://alien.slackbook.org/blog/adding- ... boot-menu/
hmmm And interesting link sunnysideofthesun. Thanks.
You'll need dd for Windows as well http://www.chrysocome.net/dd because you won't be able to boot in Linux. To see how Windows calls drives and partitions (unlike Linux /dev/sda for example) run dd --list.
If you boot the ISO rather than an install you don't need dd. I've been booting ISOs of many types for years, it's a much easier way to boot multiple systems on the same system, whether via the hdd or a USB drive.
Or after installing Porteus you can try EasyBCD, then this utilty will add boot entry for you (hopefully) https://neosmart.net/EasyBCD/ . It's free for personal use.
I tried EasyBCD years ago, not that impressed.
If you survive task of making dualboot system, then you'll be able to wreck Windows from Porteus. Good luck.
If you're any good you will be able to wreck all kinds of systems from all kinds of systems. :D
Ed

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Re: Installing Porteus alongside Windows 8.1 (dualbooting)

Post#7 by sunnysideofthesun » 21 Jul 2015, 10:30

Ed_P wrote:
sunnysideofthesun wrote:But the general way of adding Linux to Windows preserving Windows monarchy is to boot Linux with Windows loader. I guess it is buried somewhere deep in Ed_P's links to threads too.
Not that deep, see the above link. :)
Time of my post you've quoted: 20 Jul 2015, 02:16
Time of your post you've linked to: 20 Jul 2015, 15:41
So it's resurfaced like something that can't drown. Nice.
First you have to install Porteus to free partition (and do not overwrite windows bootloader accidentally).
Actually you don't have to install Porteus, nor need a free partition, thus minimal impact on the existing system. See the above link.
OP asked how he can install Porteus. Although I agree that grub loader is more versatile in terms of supporting sources for booting.
And without installing in ext# partition usage of separate file for keeping changes is necessary in both cases (frugal install and iso loading). But where do fixes in form of .xzm modules go when you use booting from iso and update function from Porteus Settings Centre?

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Re: Installing Porteus alongside Windows 8.1 (dualbooting)

Post#8 by Ed_P » 21 Jul 2015, 12:43

sunnysideofthesun wrote:And without installing in ext# partition usage of separate file for keeping changes is necessary in both cases (frugal install and iso loading). But where do fixes in form of .xzm modules go when you use booting from iso and update function from Porteus Settings Centre?
For changes one uses the Porteus Savefile Manager to create a save.dat file and for modules one creates a Modules folder/directory. Both of these are saved to a Windows type file system.

On this system I have the hard drive divided into 3 accessible partitions, Windows (sda3), Data (sda5), Backups (sda6). All formatted as NTFS. On the Data partition I have an ISOs directory:

Code: Select all

guest@porteus:~$ ls /mnt/sda5/ISOs/Porteus*
/mnt/sda5/ISOs/Porteus-Kiosk-3.4.0-i486.iso*
/mnt/sda5/ISOs/Porteus-LXQT-v3.1-x86_64-nu.iso*
/mnt/sda5/ISOs/Porteus-LXQT-v3.1-x86_64.iso*
/mnt/sda5/ISOs/Porteus-LXQT-v3.1.lst*
/mnt/sda5/ISOs/Porteus-RazorQT-v2.1-x86_64.iso*
/mnt/sda5/ISOs/Porteus-RazorQT-v3.0.1-i486-nu.iso*
/mnt/sda5/ISOs/Porteus-RazorQT-v3.0.1-i486.iso*
/mnt/sda5/ISOs/Porteus-RazorQT-v3.0.1-x86_64-nu.iso*
/mnt/sda5/ISOs/Porteus-RazorQT-v3.0.1-x86_64.iso*
/mnt/sda5/ISOs/Porteus-RazorQT-v3.0.lst*
/mnt/sda5/ISOs/Porteus.lst*
/mnt/sda5/ISOs/Porteus.lst\ Bkup\ -\ Shortcut.lnk*
guest@porteus:~$ 
And I have 3 Porteus directories: /mnt/sda5/Porteus2.1, /mnt/sda5/Porteus3.0, /mnt/sda5/Porteus3.1. Within each Porteus directory I have several subdirectories, for example:

Code: Select all

guest@porteus:~$ ls /mnt/sda5/porteus3.1
Guest/  Modules/  changes/  log/  mloop.txt*  modnetwork/
In the changes directory I have the save.dat file.

Code: Select all

guest@porteus:~$ ls /mnt/sda5/porteus3.1/changes
porteussave.dat*
In the Modules directory I have the .xzm modules.

Code: Select all

guest@porteus:~$ ls /mnt/sda5/porteus3.1/Modules
001-core_alldesktops-150124.xzm*
002-xorg_alldesktops-150126.xzm*
004-lxqt_fixes-150120.xzm*
07-printing.xzm*
MyWines.xzm*
Wine-1.7.26-x64-GeckoMono-1.xzm*
flashplayer-plugin-11.2.202.491-x86_64-1alien.xzm*
jre-8u51-x86_64-1.xzm*
kpat/
upkernel-3.18.18-noarch-1.xzm*
xgames-0.3-x86_64-4.xzm*
xscreensaver-5.29-x86_64-1_slack14.1.xzm*
And I pull all these pieces together when I boot Porteus with code like this:

Code: Select all

quiet from=/ISOs/Porteus-RazorQT-v3.0.1-x86_64.iso changes=EXIT:/porteus3.0/changes/porteussave.dat extramod=/porteus3.0/Modules volume=40 reboot=cold ramsize=80%
OK?
Ed

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Re: Installing Porteus alongside Windows 8.1 (dualbooting)

Post#9 by sunnysideofthesun » 21 Jul 2015, 13:01

Ed_P wrote:OK?
Dunno, ask someone new to Linux (OP for example) if he wants lot of manual work this way or another.

And you lied in this post viewtopic.php?f=53&t=4699&p=34175#p34140
Why don't you just openly tell fanthom and brokenman "guys, nobody appreciates crap you code, your update button is good for nothing and I won't use it"?

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Re: Installing Porteus alongside Windows 8.1 (dualbooting)

Post#10 by francois » 21 Jul 2015, 13:45

@Szalay;
Thus I reiterate work with a usb install, and once and familiar with linux or porteus, backup windows if you still need it.

Then do as I did, wipe out the windows crap and replace it with linux. There is nothing that windows did that I could not do with linux. I have been cleaned from windows completely for almost five years. 8)

If you get nostalgic of windows run it in virtual box or reinstall it all on your hdd leaving a partition for porteus. :)
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Re: Installing Porteus alongside Windows 8.1 (dualbooting)

Post#11 by Ed_P » 21 Jul 2015, 14:18

sunnysideofthesun wrote:Dunno, ask someone new to Linux (OP for example) if he wants lot of manual work this way or another.
"lot" is a subjective word. Kinda like "beauty". Yes there are several steps but all are easy and take little time and meet the goal of dualbooting with Windows.
And you lied in this post viewtopic.php?f=53&t=4699&p=34175#p34140
Why don't you just openly tell fanthom and brokenman "guys, nobody appreciates crap you code, your update button is good for nothing and I won't use it"?
I didn't lie, it worked for me, back then. I suspect the current problem is tied to SourceForge's problem. And if brokenman returns next month he can fix whatever needs to be done.
Ed

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Re: Installing Porteus alongside Windows 8.1 (dualbooting)

Post#12 by sunnysideofthesun » 21 Jul 2015, 14:35

Ed_P wrote:I didn't lie, it worked for me, back then. I suspect the current problem is tied to SourceForge's problem. And if brokenman returns next month he can fix whatever needs to be done.
It couldn't work for you because this function downloads fixes to /porteus/base folder which is read-only in .iso case.

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Re: Installing Porteus alongside Windows 8.1 (dualbooting)

Post#13 by Ed_P » 21 Jul 2015, 15:55

sunnysideofthesun wrote:It couldn't work for you because this function downloads fixes to /porteus/base folder which is read-only in .iso case.
Are these the fixes you're referring to?

Code: Select all

guest@porteus:~$ ls /mnt/sda5/porteus3.0/Modules/00*
/mnt/sda5/porteus3.0/Modules/001-core_alldesktops-150124.xzm*
/mnt/sda5/porteus3.0/Modules/002-xorg_alldesktops-150119.xzm*
/mnt/sda5/porteus3.0/Modules/002-xorg_alldesktops-150126.xzm*
Ed

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Re: Installing Porteus alongside Windows 8.1 (dualbooting)

Post#14 by sunnysideofthesun » 21 Jul 2015, 16:00

Yes plus 004-lxqt_fixes-150120.xzm
Now your Modules directory has 00 folder?No, it's another executable.
No-no, is it a wildcard?
Last edited by sunnysideofthesun on 21 Jul 2015, 16:28, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Installing Porteus alongside Windows 8.1 (dualbooting)

Post#15 by Ed_P » 21 Jul 2015, 16:21

sunnysideofthesun wrote:Yes plus 004-lxqt_fixes-150120.xzm
Now your Modules directory has 00 folder?No, it's another executable.
In my /mnt/sda5/porteus3.1/Modules/ folder I have that. The 00* characters are to limit the Modules listing to just the system modules.

I'm not sure where the Porteus Settings Centre Update function originally downloaded them to, /home/guest or /tmp most likely, and I simply copied them to my Modules folder.
Ed

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